MrL

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Mr. L probably has a better up-air than Jaice - Danzah

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Region: QLD Queensland
Main: Super Smash Bros. for Wii U - Duck Hunt Duck Hunt Duo
Wii U: Benjamin01
Joined: 08/31/2015 09:40:02
Likes: 464
Posts: 734
Shoutouts: 238

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Mafia is Back | game over, mafia win

Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
Why'd you vote for autumn?
11/12/2016 12:37:04

Mafia is Back | game over, mafia win

Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
So I guess the people who have done the least so far are Dyna_Hole, Basty, CJ and LachlanF.

Laggy has actually been more active and useful than previous games to be fair.. Marginally tho

Do we still want to lynch him to move the game forward?
11/12/2016 12:03:03

Mafia is Back | game over, mafia win

Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
While it's most likely just noobish behaviour. cAKE does have a point.

I played similarly in my first game and I'm pretty sure I was mafia. I might remember wrong though.
11/12/2016 08:23:58

Mafia is Back | game over, mafia win

Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
Yeah definitely.

Do you think your lowkey suspicions are of enough note to discuss or reveal yet? Just anything to talk about right now or any info/perspectives people have would be good really
@Maribro ^
11/12/2016 07:39:07

Mafia is Back | game over, mafia win

Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
Maribro said:
I honestly think that lynching laggy could be our best bet but we shouldn't be lynching him in less than 24 hours. We need to use this time to look at people's behaviour.

I'm already suspicious of a couple of people lowkey
I agree that we should take our time with the first day. That's mainly why I'm getting vibes from Cake, Aero and Basty for starting hastily. I assume yours was just a troll vote seeing as you retracted it. Or just saw that things were moving too quickly?

Personally I think Autumnwind's behaviour has just been noobish rather than suspicious and that Lachlan's vote was pretty unwarranted and something to look at. Although he has a tendency to not care about mafia that much, like laggy.

If either laggy gets lynched or he participates more, we could look into pressuring lachlan more?

I'll start with a vote for Lachlan so he can provide more reasoning.

Vote: LachlanF
11/12/2016 07:32:30

Mafia is Back | game over, mafia win

Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
Not much to say really.

Closest thing to suspicious behaviour so far is Cake's starting-of and Basty's following-of the bandwagon with no reasoning provided, especially as this is Basty's first mafia I think ? So he doesn't exactly have the past experience of laggy's uselessness as reason to vote so quickly.

We all know laggy hasn't been too helpful but it was a bit abrupt. Maribro and Aero's votes aren't exactly atypical and they've both provided reasoning/further explanation since so they're not suspects at this point.

Most likely an over-analysis but it's something I spose. Laggy hasn't said anything even with the votes, so I'll vote for him in 14 minutes (half past) to put him to L-1 and apply pressure.
11/12/2016 06:16:53

Mafia is Back | game over, mafia win

Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
Count me in! Glad these are back :)
11/03/2016 12:41:59

Really Random Tournament 2

Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
I'd like to join up too please :D
10/28/2016 08:42:13

Top Doggo - Duck Hunt Duo Bracket

Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
Sign me up! :D
10/28/2016 08:41:40

Australian Super Smash Bros. for Wii U and 3DS Wifi Online Thread 25

Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
Poppt1 I'll verse you if you're still up for some
10/12/2016 04:43:24

Australian Super Smash Bros. for Wii U and 3DS Wifi Online Thread 25

Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
Sure!
10/06/2016 13:31:44

Australian Super Smash Bros. for Wii U and 3DS Wifi Online Thread 25

Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
anyone up for games?
10/04/2016 14:24:59

[Badge] QLD Smash Annual Forum Awards 2016 - Results announced

Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
QLD Smash Annual Forum Awards - VOTING FORM

1. Who is your favourite tournament organiser?

Mcjobo fo sho

2. Which player do you enjoy watching the most?

Waveguider

3. Who is your favourite Super Smash Bros. commentator?

Jett

4. If QLD Smash had a villain, who would it be?

Mcjobo

5. Who is the most attractive Smash player?

Mcjobo

6. Who do you find to be the most influential Smash player?

Sonder

7. Who do you find to be the funniest Smash player?

Mcjobo

8. Who do you think is the best Smash player in Australia?

Extra

9. Who do you think is the best up and coming Smash player?

Kneesus

10. Who is your favourite Smash player, for any reason?

Mcjobo - WAH
09/30/2016 02:12:05

#Sondergate

Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
I miss you B2 :'(
09/26/2016 01:21:29

Australian Super Smash Bros. for Wii U and 3DS Wifi Online Thread 24

Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
Online anyone?
08/16/2016 10:58:40

LachlanF Q&A, all questions welcome.

Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
Is barry ok
08/11/2016 08:05:11

Australian overseas smash trip 2017

Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
Yeah true. I think Genesis would be a good one to aim for.

How about everyone buy a lottery ticket each day, and when we win the jackpot we fund a team to go to Genesis. Easy
07/19/2016 04:55:49

Australian overseas smash trip 2017

Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
I'd be totally up for this.

Imo, it might best to enter a UK major or a European international cos that'd probably be closer to our level of play. Would be a cool indicater of where we place in the world (cos we obvs won't do too well in US or Japan atm [we getting there though]).

It'd be cool to try get a group for Genesis 4, but if we don't have many people ready for that then UK could be a cool one to go to. Would be good to see which scene is better :o
07/19/2016 00:54:28

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Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
I never said mine was perfect, that statement was merely saying that whatever is done, it won't be 100% accurate. I don't know why you feel the need to put words in my mouth :/ I don't believe you understand what I have attempted to convey, nor at this point is it worth the effort.

I did not use a strawman argument, you claimed my question was one, yet you have still not answered it.

You cleared up one thing though in that you won't be wanting to put up every team. How you previously explained it sounded like that is what you wanted.

You accuse me of using strawmans, when you are the one doing that. You misquote me and put words in my mouth, all for when I ask and debate as to why a much more seemingly overcomplicated system would be used than what I had suggested.

After your responses to some of my questions, I do now understand what you were trying to explain. No thanks to your jabs though.

It's a tad strange but could still work, might as well try one of if not both suggestions to see what results are made.
07/12/2016 15:47:47

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Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
my question wasn't making a point, it was an actual question that I was hoping an answer for to determine how the situation should be approached.
You're raising issues that don't really exist.

The hypothetical situations you raise are pointless. In your situation, assuming we use the type of algorithm you propose to determine the skill of teams, there are now 20 teams that Jaice is a part of on the list of teams (just because of one person, let alone the 50 others who may switch between partners; lots of clutter). But there's also no way to determine which time is better, other than a theoretical algorithm. It may say that one team is better than another, but only in theory; the teams would need to face each other to determine that, which can't happen. Then this process would have to happen with every person.

If what you said, were to happen, the list of best teams would be:

1. Jaice + 2nd best
2. Jaice + 3rd best
3. Jaice + 4th best
4. Jaice + 5th best

and so on.

It not only would just look ridiculous to have one person in every (or even multiple) team(s) as 'the best teams' but also impossible to determine which is the best amongst those as they cannot battle eachother.

No data will ever be 100% accurate, players and results are constantly changing, and at any given time someone's elo may not represent their skill.

With set teams, there are constant variables that are pit against each other over a period of time.

Within this set of teams, a ranking order would be able to be established (and one person won't be in multiple teams that will be unable to face each other).

From this, a more accurate PR can be established.

Using that algorithm and making a new team and scoring them based on who is teaming, that will only result in the top 10 being 5 teams with jaice and 5 teams with jezmo.

With mine, yes unfortunately only set teams would be able to be eligible for ranking/PR in one season; which would exclude unofficial teams that may or may not place better than official teams.

However, I'd rather a few one-off teams slip through the cracks than have an entire list of teams be made up of one person holding the top several ranks with [insert random players]. Again, even with that list which would look ridiculous, there's no way of determining which is better among them.

It would also encourage those who do want official doubles rankings, to have an official team; while those who do not care or not want one, continue to have different doubles partners each time.

It's just not viable to have a system that tries to rank every combination of players, as that way the teams that play against each other will be different each time and impossible to accurately show improve because of the number of variables (hence why we don't already have it), let alone one person can't be on two teams at once to determine which of the two (or more) they are a part of is better.

You can do it all hypothetically with the algorithm as said but that's not reflective of actual doubles results between the various teams.
I just don't see your way as a viable or accurate way to determine the best teams.
07/12/2016 12:36:55

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Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
Prior performance with other people, not the same person.

I think the doubles elo could just as easily and more simply be calculated based on how the teams interact with eachother, with the players remaining the same, rather than individually calculating each team's capability by calculating each player's elo, characters and prior performance with different people as separate factors.

Just how singles elo isn't calculated depending on what character we use and prior tournament placings, but rather who we face each time and whether we win and lose against them each time.

The individual skill of each player plays a role in that yes, if you have better players teaming then yes in all likelihood they will do better, relying on their performance as individuals to figure out team performance won't nevessarily work.

Would it not be better observe how the team performs, as a team; rather than calculate their skill using their individual performances as the key factor.

To me it seems like its overcomplicating it when you can just start on a clean slate and see how people perform from there.

When wii u elo was first calculated, did everyone start at 1,000 again or were Wii U elo's originally calculated based on the limited 3ds elo data?
07/11/2016 13:50:02

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Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
Then the calculations won't be based on team performance, but on two individuals' performance in singles who may hypothetically team every now and then.

I think the option would be cool for those who want ranks bases off of consistent teams facing off against eachother, with the option for others to still play with a different person each time but it won't be calculated (unless they choose to team with their 'official' partner [and fought another official team].

It would allow for people to still play doubles with a different person each time, but also provide proper data on how teams face off against eachother. For there to be accurate data there needs to be a constant, I think the constant would work best as the combination of players.

If ranks are based off of the algorithm above each time a person chooses a different partner, the ranking system would become a mess (I assume) and it would be hard to track progression of skill/placing of teams over time.

Your algorithm does seem pretty cool though and would be effective, in say calculating an initial elo for teams that would be more accurate than putting them all at 1,000. Although having all teams at 1,000 will eventually even out to accurately represent each team's skill level over time.
07/11/2016 13:17:42

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Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
It would be hard to implement a system that would take prior results into account because of the constant change of players making up each team.

If there were to be an accurate system that would calculate the ranks/skills of teams, in accordance to how well they do in tournaments it would have to be as of now, and only calculating set teams in the same/similar way elo is calculated for singles players.

However, the system that you mentioned looks like it could work as a hypothetical algorithm to determine what combination of players might form an optimal team.
07/11/2016 12:14:29

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Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
oh okay, thanks :) Would be cool if the TOs could link separate games for say Top 8, or highlight sets or something :0 but I understand that they would probably not have time for it at all.

With doubles elo, could there be a kind of workaround?

Like say, a competitive profile can be made for each team, with each team acting kind of like an account..? That probably makes no sense, but i'll try explain it a bit more.

With me, I have my account (duh) and then a competitive account that I had to request to be made (again duh).

Could an admin create another competitive account upon request, but just call that e.g. Mr. L + Karnu (as opposed to how they made my singles profile, called Mr. L). and then treat the 'team account' as if it was one person with how the elo already works?

I don't have much understanding on how all the coding works and the ins and outs of the process of recording competitive data, as you could probably tell, so apologies if my enquiry was cringe-worthy to read xD

If what I tried to explain still doesn't make sense, just say and I could try again xD
07/11/2016 10:37:13

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Queensland Duck Hunt Duo
MrL
  • Wii U: Benjamin01
I know it's much easier said than done, but it could be cool if there were regular updates of good/recent sets between players that could be added to the list of videos on player profiles. A lot of people have matches that were on stream, but haven't been added to their profile. To keep workload to a minimum maybe it could only be matches for Top 8 or so.

It'd be a good way to showcase players' potential and what they have/can achieve(d) in tournaments, as well as to provide up-to-date data on how that player plays so others can study it and improve their matchup.

I'd be happy to help if it can be done.

Another thing, which has been brought up before, is elo for doubles. With people having different partners, it would be virtually impossible to provide an accurate elo for teams based on every event.

However, if, in order to be eligible for the elo, you must 'register' an official team that is/will be used in tournaments, then elo can be calculated if/when two official, registered teams face off.

E.g.

Registered teams:

Karnu + Mr. L
Umbrella + Azurewolf

Matches:

Karnu + Mr. L vs Umbrella + Azurewolf = Elo calculated because both teams in set are registered

Karnu + Mr. L vs Aero + Azurefolf = No elo calculated because latter team is not registered

Karnu + Battledolphin vs Umbrella + Azurewolf = No elo calculated because former team is not registered

Say, at the end of a 3 month season, a doubles PR is made and when the next starts; people can register new teams with a different partner, but all their prior teams' data is erased and that will be the official team for the next 3 month season.

As we have it now, only a few people might be willing to register as an official team and play consistently with each other instead of swapping. However, if there is an official system then that could be enough incentive for people to have consistent teams and work toward being on doubles PR, especially over time.

It could also lead to stronger ties between players, increasing synergy, improving the doubles brackets as a whole (just as our scenes continue to improve over time).

This also won't prevent people from mixing it up every now and then if they prefer to do that, but also rewards consistency and synergy between teams.

Idk just a couple things that is much easier said then done but ya never know could work out
07/11/2016 07:27:54

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